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I love riding at Vail Resorts-owned Keystone Ski Resort, CO but over the past 10 years, they have done a great job of pushing all of the great riders off their mountain.
I understand skier safety and I understand there are beginners on every single run but getting in trouble for snowboarding?
I wish I had the whole conversation with ski patrol but at the end of the day, one old dude with a power trip won. Be respectful while you guys ski and snowboard just like I am. Just know some people suck.
Places like Deer Valley have it figured out. Just ban boarders and be done with it.
I understand using Schoolmarm to get off the hill or down to the other set of lifts. BUT, SM is a beginner run, for beginners and full of slow inexperienced beginners. Even if you are not really “speeding”, boarding twice as fast as the people around you will get you FLAGGED by the Yellow Jackets! I like to stay on Northpeak and the Outback for my speed rush, Starfire for sure. Now if only the beginners would stay off NP and OB !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tell ya what, if all the NOOBS agreed to stay on the front mountain, then no one would need to “bomb” down SM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Keystone’s original lie is over-promoting it as a family/beginner resort when they have only 12% beginner runs. This has created the whole notorious crowded mess that is Schoolmarm. Keystone knows Schoolmarm is dangerously over-crowded, but does nothing to actually alleviate the overcrowding itself. So they go after riders instead, and try to divert the blame for their overcrowded, over-promoted mess they created. This isn’t a problem that Keystone can ticket and ban their way out of. Keystone needs to either stop over-hyping their resort for kids/beginners, or actually build out suitable lifts/trails to reduce the epicly dangerous overcrowding.
Yes, I must be a clown who loves to shred keystone and schoolmarm in particular.. haha. I live in the south San Juan’s , thank god I don’t have to deal with any of this summit county gaper games…
“I wish I had the whole conversation with ski patrol but at the end of the day, one old dude with a power trip won.”
They’re not the “ski patrol”. They’re not part of the National Ski Patrol. Don’t confuse “courtesy patrol” or “safety patrol” with the ones who save or help you when you’re injured.
https://youtu.be/ES4129d6feQ
See his new video of the raw footage of his run. The ski patrol was lying out of their asses. This looks very bad for keystone.
I’m not a fanboy by any means of this guy but he’s generally safe. Watch the raw video of his interactions with ski patrol. Email keystone. Contact them.
This needs to be straightened out before it gets too bad. Power tripping ski patrol is good for NOBODY. let’s be fair. Nothing in this video or most of his videos show nothing but safety and control. He may play around and do tricks but they are far away from most other skiers.
He was DEFINITELY NOT bombing the mountain. This guy is into butters. He doesn’t bomb the mountain unless he’s sending it on a jump.
Safety girl playing with phone in video. OK for her to be unsafe!
I think what most of the apologists for the riders are overlooking is that the well marked slow/family zone is filled with inexperienced skiers and it is *their* lack of control that is the reason *everyone* must go slow.
This is exactly why I don’t ski resort anymore and spend 70 – 90 days a season in the backcountry. Skiing used to be adventurous and exciting. Now it’s run by a bunch of businesspeople that make the mountains tame and lame so they can maximize revenue by making sure all the scary-cat lemmings can have a quiet and reassuring experience on their slopes. They wring out the passion, the fun, and the excitement of skiing absolutely killing the sport. As long as a skier or rider is in control (and these guys clearly were), patrol should not be allowed to make random “judgment calls”. This is just another appallingly incompetent call by a “ski patroller” completely lacking in any sort of judgment – a horrible reflection on Keystone as well as vail.
Seriously? Business isn’t allowed to patrol, the red jackets, and administer to those injured? The yellow jackets are safety and shouldn’t pull tickets from reckless skiers/snowboarders on BEGINNER hills that this youtuber is crying about but shouldn’t be on that slope since he’s obviously very good but wanted to share his tale of woe is me? How does that equate to your utopian ideals of skiing or snowboarding in a manner safe enough so yahoos that fly off a jump or precipice on skis or board lands on a boulder because the moron didn’t check for obstructions? Get over yourself with your history of what it was like in your youth. Try running a business like big mountain snow sports and satisfy your insurance underwriter that you can run it as safe as possible yet avoid the useless and needless moronic behavior of reckless skiers and snowboarders doing tricks that ends up in litigation? Guess what tort liability lawsuits are about when the climate of “its not my fault the boulder was the landing but I’m gonna’ sue your asses off so I can become an instant millionaire?” Yeah, morons taking risks that end up as paraplegics suing big mountain sports because they can’t admit they were reckless and assumed they know it all yet ended up paralyzed for life and want to make big mountain sports pay for their mistakes?! You’re so far off base it’s bordering on ridiculous with your remarks. Stop crying about it and just do as you already stated, stay in the back country. Oh and by the way, when you fall down and can’t get out, who’s gonna get your ass out? Not your friends since at least one will carry a cellphone and make the call for….guess what? R-E-S-C-U-E, forest service, EMTs in helicopter, possibly the men and women you bemoan about – the safety patrollers nearby but not responsible for backcountry accidents yet will respond when summoned. Why? Because that’s what they trained for, along with rescue services from a simple 9-11 call to summon fire and rescue. All paid from taxes to haul out those assuming they know it all, safe in the back country or hiking without training. Those that are found reckless are now being considered liable to repay for the costs of rescue services just because more and more reckless behavior are undertaken by poorly equipped and ill trained people that have no business in the backcountry or hiking with incorrect gear. I have no issues and admire people going into the backcountry and never reveal the wonders of exploring untouched nature. The same for hikers and mountain climbers. As long as you’re well informed, take courses in avalanche detection, carry gear for the unexpected change in weather, radio, etc. The intelligent person learns all the time to improve on a skill set and accepts defeat as a learning tool to continue becoming better. Not complain and take on an adversarial position.
As a female, skier for 49 years, who has a family of skiers, worked as a lifeguard and patrolled, you would expect that safety would matter to me. Children have been killed and I have been hit by out of control skiers. That is why I wear a helmet. Safety is the most important issue. After watching the FULL video, (If you don’t watch it, you don’t know the facts)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ES4129d6feQ.
I am angry. “Pulling a Ticket” or “Ripping a Ticket” is serious and should only be done with just cause following respectful professional procedures. They don’t seem to have a procedure. “Stop. Let me see your pass.” that is not a procedure. That wasn’t a chat.
The bearded safety guy was hostile and unprofessional. In my opinion, he needs a vacation and to take an anger management and sensitivity class. I would feel totally comfortable sharing the slope with these 4 riders and any child. They road safe and under control and never cut anyone off. I would have been more angry than them if I had been treated in that manner by the safety staff and told right off, “Let me see your pass.”
My speed on that slope could have been faster and I have never been stopped or warned in 49 years. Safety is the most important issue, but that doesn’t justify being disrespectful, unprofessional, unfair, and killing the joy of a great run or day. From what I saw they road safe. I agree, vote with your wallet. This is overshadowing my former fond memories of Keystone.
In the absence of Warren Miller, who promotes snow sports? Good skiers and riders who blog and shoot YouTube videos. Who will buy a pass in bad weather years and bad economic years? Good riders and skiers. If they are treated badly you kill your sustainability as a mountain. These 4 riders will most likely be back to ski your mountain but not me. Now when I think Keystone, I will think of that overreacting, rude, unprofessional bearded guy. I wouldn’t want anyone I know to have a run-in with that guy.
Love how you talk about him not giving you a warning as you ride past all these slow signs and new riders on a beginner trail. Was that your first time there? Or first time snowboarding? Hate to call out another rider, but, A. You got caught doing side hits in what looks like a learn to ride trail, in Colorado, on a mountain with sick terrain, with powder in the woods?! and 2. You zeached nearly all your slides, the ones you made it to the end anyway…
Love how you think the guy stopping you is your first warning after you roll down a trail filled with slow signs. I’d have more sympathy for you as a rider except for A. You got caught on a beginner trail doing side hits and 2. You Zeached nearly all your board slides, and not even on purpose…bro.
Maybe they should put a speed limit on each run, everyone has GPS and knows how fast they went on a run, it would really help skiers defend themselves against the yellow jackets, I had a problem with one skiing the glades, I’m the first one in my group nobody dropped in before us so we’re ripping it, I come over this roller and there’s a downed skier, ski patrol, and yellow jackets, I stop in plenty of time and my three friends stop right behind me, the yellow jacket starts yelling at me that we’re going too fast. So I start yelling the code back to him, always stay visible, they were all in the blind and none of them were up on the top of the roller where they could be seen. I was probably going maybe 10-15mph.
Sick video! Be wary with the ikon pass to. They have been pulling the same bs at Copper. I don’t really understand why the “mountain safety” thinks it’s “safe” to run in front of a skier and snowboarder to stop them. Mountain safety needs to stop acting like rent-a-cops giving out speeding tickets and start concentrating on the people who are skiing out of control.
Ha-ha, so you got nailed ripping down Schoolmarm, the beginners hill and opened your video stating avoiding the lines in the other areas? Who are you kidding? You’re the one sucking and complaining because you don’t belong on a beginners run full of learners that can’t get out of their own way. Your skills are for the snowboard park and intermediate or expert terrain. If you won’t check your speed where you knew beginners are moving hazards, you deserve having your ticket pulled. Yes, the old geyser pulled you and friends because safety is recognized by mature adults given the job to watch over everyone’s safety, not by young men or women that haven’t learned to accept the responsibility to stop speeders on beginners terrain. You’re too wrapped up into yourself with a ‘crew’ following with go pros and was obvious to safety patrollers. That’s why you were pulled.
I mean…….if you want to ride fast get away from the front side of the mountain where all of the beginners hang out. Plain and simple. I love bombing down the hills too, but I know when and where to do so. Sorry guy, you’re in the wrong on this one :/
The guy who made this video is a complete fucking douchebag. Thanks for trying to make us watch 10 minutes of your highlight reel (you aren’t even that good) to get to the part your video is about. Glad you’re off the mountain for a bit you fucking gaper. Go back to Denver tunnel trash. Hope you get that sponsorship…
Would much rather ride with dudes with amazing board skills as is evidenced by the video than people who have not done their research and come to the mountain ill prepared and unaware of basic ski/board etiquette. The latter are usually the ones that cause crashes and issues. Not knocking beginners cause we were all there but these dudes have the wherewithall to keep themselves safe and others as well because of their advanced riding skills.
They’re not that good…
There should be no place for reckless straight liners sliding too fast on any groomed run whether it is green, blue or black. If you want to exhibit your skills then do it off piste or in the terrain parks or the trees or in the moguls. I applaud Vail’s actions to police straight lining speedsters on groomed runs.
We have many great friends who are boarders, but Keystone made the right call on this one. Speeding boarders are the main reason we disliked skiing Keystone, and stopped going there years ago. We’ve had more close calls with boarders at Keystone than any of the other 10 resorts we’ve been to, combined! And School Marm Run? Really? This is a slow speed family area. Period.
I was skiing Schoolmarm that same day with my kids and visiting relatives, all beginners. It was insanely packed and there were quite a few boarders/skiers flying by all day. I saw these guys pulled to the side by ski patrol but didn’t recognize them as any of the ones that made it feel unsafe for my kids. Maybe they were the scapegoat for all the others? That being said, it wasn’t a day for anyone to use Schoolmarm that didn’t need to.
I got smacked from behind by a snowboarder near the bottom of Peak 8 a few seasons ago within 10m of a yellow jacket. I spun on my skis like a top. No word from the YJ at all.
25 years ago at Keystone 3 of us were doing full tuck on skis, top to bottom, and had them waiting for us at the bottom and then ripped our lift passes from our jackets. They did not even say anything to us.. just ran up in the lift line and took our passes.. You seemed like in complete control and easily came to a stop when he ran out in front of you.. Is there anything on the lift pass now that states rules one must abide by?
I am a former ski racer (competed in many DH races going 60-80 mph) and feel your pain. I think the problem is that the ski police look at every one is at their ability level. The times that I have been reprimanded have always been by “old guys” of which I am now and women. Their egos do not allow them to consider that anyone may have more ability. On the flip side, too many skiers and boarders do not consider the ‘startle factor’ that they create on people with less ability. You may handle it but can be the innocent party that causes the beginner to lose it.
None of the great riders want to ride there because they can’t bomb down beginner runs? lol
The yellow jackets are a joke and everybody knows it. The fact that Vail gives them a quota like a cop is blatantly corrupt. Granted we are talking about the company that ruined the ski industry so….
There is no quota. That is ridiculous.
As a dad who was on this run teaching my 6 year old how to ski the other day, this is NO place for fast riding. Someone weighing 3x more and going 5x faster hitting someone else can be lethal. The brother of my college roommate was killed at Stowe by a boarder going too fast while he learning to ride. It is no joke.
Vail has the little guns that Id you when you get on the lifts. It would be easy enough to give a warning rather than end your day and make you buy a class to get your pass back. Two warnings, take a seat.
Schoolmarm is a family run. It is also often the only path out of the terrain park…
According to the video, it didn’t seem particularly crowded or unsafe.
Too many snowboarders go to fast and on the edge of control. And what’s with them needing to come within inches of people stopped, as demonstrated in his/this video. Too many bad boarders and he felt the repercussions.
I did not see the edge of control. In fact when stopped they quockly and safley came to a stop. I wonder if you would you say this if it was a skier in the video?
My partner is a 5th grade teacher and her kids regularly produce work of a higher standard than this article
SnowBrains….I just got dumber from this article. Idiots skiing fast on beginner terrain and getting in trouble is NOT news worthy!
I know this boarder. He’s one of the nicest guys and often preaches snowboarding safety. Seriously.
I didn’t watch this. The problem gets resolved by going night skiing at Keystone.. There is zero patrol monitoring skier safety. That is, you can haul ass uninterrupted on any night skiing run. Obviously there are way way way less people, which is both the reason and the point.
Day skiing is good for going to bowls and trees. Night skiing is for speed. Period.
I ski 60 to 80 days a season at a large number of resorts. In the past five years I have seen a huge increase in the number of “jerk skiers/boarders” jerk skiing is reckless skiing. Passing too close (with in 15 feet is too close using Deer Valley’s rule), skiing very fast through slower groups of skiers etc. are examples of reckless selfish skiing.
Boarders have a tendency to “straightline” down blue and green runs at high rates of speed. And way too often they do not want to turn when other people are ahead of them. So they pass within a few feet. This is extremely dangerous because the person skiing or boarding below has the complete right of way. And they can change direction or pattern without warning.
The video does not give enough information to know what the boarder was doing that was reckless, but the fact that an adult observer (the yellow jacket) believed they were reckless is ok with me.
People seem to think that they can do anything on the slope regardless of the danger they create. It has to stop. I would like to see the resorts pursue criminal prosecution for reckless skiing/boarding.
As skiers/ boarders we are often moving at 30 to 40 miles per hour (or even high speeds) and the consequences of reckless behavior cannot be tolerated anymore. Your “fun” does not give you license to endanger those around you.
Lol you saw them do nothing wrong but some dude on a power trip says they did so that’s good enough for you? It’s people like you that ruin the sport. Actually it’s people like you that are ruining this country. Fucking lemmings.
You should stay home…its safer.
Ok, boomer
Schoolmarm is THE beginner trail at Keystone and even on a slow day it’s packed with beginners. Over the holidays it’s super crowded. There’s plenty of trails at Keystone to ski or ride fast but Schoolmarm is not one of them. There are slow signs all the way down that trail to try and get the advanced skiers and riders heading to the park or the fun cruisers to slow down. There is really no excuse for anyone to bomb that run and I have no sympathy for anyone whose given a warning or has to take a safety class. It’s important for all of us who ski and ride to take safety seriously. I was probably there that day and it was super busy on the front side of Keystone, especially the beginner runs on the west side of Keystone.
I agree with the last post. I ski Keystone all the time. I rarely ski schoolmarm because it is a beginner run with skiers and boarders learning how to turn and stop. When I do go down the green family run I go slow and instruct my son to do the same. Nothing more frustrating when these fools who are obviously great riders come flying down showing off and putting everyone in danger. Keystone only has a few green beginner runs.. leave for the beginners and do your fast riding on the blues and blacks.
100% agree. You see trains of little kids and more-than-the-occasional panicking adult all over schoolmarm. Keystone is a huge space. Surely, if you wanna rip down the mountain, you can find another run.
I love Keystone and Im an intermediate and I love to freeride fast on my Flight Attendant but I do avoid schoolman during the runs I do because too many beginners and its very difficult to go fast without putting someone in danger since its so busy. I hit the other blues and some blacks and at end of day i leisurely take schoolman down to the parking lots. I do feel bad for the guy here seriously, hes very good and I know he was just enjoying himself and Im sure he know to give right of way to others. Hopefully he will get his pass back.
Youre missing the point and I’m assuming most of the comments still complaining about the riders didnt even watch the full video. They werent bombing down the run at all. They stopped at least 3 times, are shown heel braking on the steeper parts, staying on the side of the trail, passing multiple yellow jackets who werent saying anything to them and were able to immediately stop for the last yellow jacket that was on foot with no issues. Yellow jackets lied multiple times trying to justify their BS and didnt even help that one skier who yard sale’d right next to them. I’ve seen skiers and snowboarders bomb down schoolmarm… the point is these guys didnt and the yellow jackets are liars.
Also, even though Schoolmarm is a slow green, you have to go down it to get to some good blues (frenchman, wild irishman, paymaster, silvermaster, silverspoon and hoodoo).
Not a ski patrolmen, mountain safety !
Ski patrol wears red jackets .
Mountain safety wears yellow jackets .
Get your facts straight.
Vail resorts absolutely enjoys sucking the fun out skiing and riding at their resorts. I can ski all day at mammoth and not be stopped once for skiing fast but in control.
Go to any Vail resort and ski fast and you will get your pass pulled . It’s simple economics , charge people an enormous amount of money to ski or snowboard then kick them off the mountain. One the worst policies I’ve experienced at any ski resort in the world. Only Vail can make you feel like you are a bad person for trying to have fun .
Vote with your wallet and don’t ski or snowboard at Vail owned resorts.
I didn’t watch this. The problem gets resolved by going night skiing at Keystone.. There is zero patrol monitoring skier safety. That is, you can haul ass uninterrupted on any night skiing run. Obviously there are way way way less people, which is both the reason and the point.
Day skiing is good for going to bowls and trees. Night skiing is for speed. Period. we
Totally missed THE SNOWBOARDER’S SECRET weapon:
Some boarders who play around in the terrain parks often “DE-TUNE” their
boards … meaning – they round their edges with a rock or a file; they intentionally dull their edges, so their boards won’t catch on the pipes and rails.
The implications are terrifying: some of those snowboarders are zooming around the mountain on boards with dull / rounded edges.
What’s the stopping distance for a board with rounded edges ?
Hah ! Go Figure….
Skier’s do the same but it’s only out of pocket when a snowboarder does it…you must be an old democratic griefer!
This is an exaggeration, it is not a secret and definitely not a weapon. Not many detune their boards. And most people who do aren’t detuning their boards to the point of compromising their ability to stop or turn.
That’s a very uneducated, bias and heavily exaggerated comment.
Run looked pretty crowded. What’s with pointing out the patrolmen’s age? Sounds like you still have a lot of growing up to do.
He urge does…
He sure does…
Sorry man but the older generation up in summit county have grudges. They are always pissed, tend to over react, and won’t see another side. And that’s mountain safety, not patrol. Patrollers tends to give warnings and not power trip. I think that’s mostly cause they get to blow stuff up.
Wow snowbrains! Your articles generally seem like they were written by children, but this one really takes the cake. Is there nothing else happening in the world of snow sports, that there has to be an “article” about gapers riding keystone?
You’re a clown for this comment
Clown …let me guess ur from Texas
Hmm. I’m an “old guy” (66) and have been skiing for 63 yrs and I didn’t see any problem with their riding. Of course, they could have cut out parts but I didn’t see others panicking to get out of their ways.
I’ve seen the whole raw clip and it actually makes keystone look even worse. Believe it or not it was edited to not make keystone look as full of lies as the whole clip actually does
I’m almost 50 so I feel ya.
Keystone’s original lie is over-promoting it as a family/beginner resort when they have only 12% beginner runs. This has created the whole notorious crowded mess that is Schoolmarm. Keystone knows Schoolmarm is dangerously over-crowded, but does nothing to actually alleviate the overcrowding itself. So they go after riders instead, and try to divert the blame for their overcrowded, over-promoted mess they created.
This isn’t a problem that Keystone can ticket and ban their way out of. Keystone needs to either stop over-hyping their resort for kids/beginners, or actually build out suitable lifts/trails to reduce the epicly dangerous overcrowding.